Billy Graham Center Archives

Collection 74 - Herbert E. Anderson. T77 Transcript

Click here to listen to an audio file of of the unrestricted portion this interview (42 minutes)

This is a complete and accurate transcript of the tape of the oral history interview of Dr. Herbert E. Anderson (CN 74, T77) in the Archives of the Billy Graham Center. No spoken words have been omitted, except for any non-English phrases which could not be understood by the transcribers. Foreign terms are not commonly understood appear in italics. In very few cases words were too unclear to be distinguished. If the transcriber was not completely sure of having gotten what the speaker said, "[?]" was inserted after the word or phrase in question. If the speech was inaudible or indistinguishable, "[unclear]" was inserted. Grunts and verbal hesitations such as "ah" or "um" were usually omitted. The transcribers have not attempted to phonetically replicate English dialects but have instead entered the standard English word the speaker was expressing. Readers should remember that this is a transcript of spoken English, which follows a different rhythm and rule than written English. Foreign terms or phrases which may be unfamiliar appear in italics.
... Three dots indicate an interruption or break in the train of thought within the sentence on the part of the speaker.
.... Four dots indicate what the transcriber believes to be the end of an incomplete sentence.
( ) Words in parentheses are asides made by the speaker.
[ ] Words in brackets are comments by the transcriber.
This transcription was made by Bob Shuster, Katherine Graber and Paul Bartow was completed in February 2014.


***
This is a complete and accurate transcript of the tape of the oral history interview of Dr. Herbert Anderson (CN 74, T77) in the Archives of the Billy Graham Center. No spoken words have been omitted, except for any non-English phrases which could not be understood by the transcribers. Foreign terms are not commonly understood appear in italics. In very few cases words were too unclear to be distinguished. If the transcriber was not completely sure of having gotten what the speaker said, "[?]" was inserted after the word or phrase in question. If the speech was inaudible or indistinguishable, "[unclear]" was inserted. Grunts and verbal hesitations such as "ah" or "um" were usually omitted. The transcribers have not attempted to phonetically replicate English dialects but have instead entered the standard English word the speaker was expressing. Readers should remember that this is a transcript of spoken English, which follows a different rhythm and rule than written English. Foreign terms or phrases which may be unfamiliar appear in italics.
... Three dots indicate an interruption or break in the train of thought within the sentence on the part of the speaker.
.... Four dots indicate what the transcriber believes to be the end of an incomplete sentence.
( ) Words in parentheses are asides made by the speaker.
[ ] Words in brackets are comments by the transcriber.
This transcription was made by Bob Shuster, Katherine Graber and Paul Bartow was completed in February 2014.

***

Collection 74, T77. Interview of Herbert Anderson by Bob Shuster on November 15, 2010.


SHUSTER: This is an interview with Dr. Herbert Anderson by Bob Shuster for the Billy Graham Center Archives. It took place on November 15th, 2010 at 11:30 Pacific Standard time over the telephone. And it was recorded over the telephone...yes recorded over the telephone. Well, good morning Dr. Anderson.  

ANDERSON: Hi. Good morning.
 
SHUSTER: Let me first ask you when and where were you born?  

ANDERSON: I was born in Madrid, Iowa on March 1, 1916.

SHUSTER: And what years were you at Wheaton College as a student?

ANDERSON: I was there from ‘37 to ‘41.

SHUSTER: How did you come to choose Wheaton?

ANDERSON: Well that was when I was in junior high school I think, a quartet came to our church. And I decided then that I wanted to go to Wheaton College.

UNIDENTIFIED WOMAN AT ANDERSON” END OF THE PHONE: And that church was in...?

ANDERSON: But yeah, that church was in Gothenburg, Nebraska. A little town in Nebraska.

SHUSTER: What was it about the quartet that made you want to go there?

ANDERSON: What was it about the quartet? I was just their enthusiasm, the whole thing. Their musicianship. But I was just attracted to Wheaton College because of them.

UNIDENTIFIED WOMAN AT ANDERSON” END OF THE PHONE: Do you remember who were the men in that quartet?

ANDERSON: Oh no I don’t remember that. No, I don’t.

SHUSTER: Do you recall how you first met Billy Graham?

ANDERSON: Uh...I think I was in one anthropology class with him. But I knew him before.... We knew each other. And...but I think I was a junior when he came as a freshman.

SHUSTER: Uh-huh.

ANDERSON: And then he...my contact with him (I think I mentioned that to you already) that I was president of one of the literary societies and Billy became a member there. And that was...so we had some personal contacts as he...several times (I think I mentioned that to you) that he would...take the devotions for our Friday night meetings every once in a while. I’d get him to do that for us.

SHUSTER: What was the name of the literary society?

ANDERSON: It was called the Knights. That was the name of it. But the name would be Naitermian. N-A-I-T-E-R...naitermie...[sounding it out] -I-A-N, I think. Naitermain society. But we were just called the Knights. K-N-I-G-H-T-S.

SHUSTER: And you mentioned that Billy Graham became a member?

ANDERSON: Yeah he became a member because almost everybody joined one of the literary societies. They...and they were the social...the social units in Wheaton College.

SHUSTER: And what usually happened at your Friday night meetings?

ANDERSON: Well we would have...we would have a brief devotional from somebody and then there would be someone...sometimes there would be several debates. They would be...they would be on current issues, some of them. Or on something that had to do with...our scholasticism. That type of thing. They were social, but they were also intellectual.

SHUSTER: So what were some of the topics of debates that you had?

ANDERSON: Some of the topics? Would have been some of the political issues . But usually they would have been something...some kind of spiritual issue that might of been at that time...an issue in that period.

SHUSTER: Can you think of any examples?

ANDERSON: [Sighs] I may think of one [laughs]...right now. I may come up with something. But I’m not sure right now. I don’t remember anything. It was so long ago, you know?

SHUSTER: Do you have any recollection why Graham joined the Knights as opposed to another society?

ANDERSON: No, I don’t know why he joined the Knights. It’s possible that I had some influence in talking to him about joining the Knights. I think that may have been it. But I don’t remember if there’s anything specific.

SHUSTER: Do you recall the first time you met?

ANDERSON: The first time we met? No I don’t. I...I do remember that we stopped to talk somewhere on the campus.... It was just a personal contact we made sometime on the campus. Not in class, but it was somewhere. And that’s why we sort of struck up not a close relationship, but a casual, friendly relationship.

SHUSTER: You mentioned that you sometimes asked him to give devotions. Why him?

ANDERSON: That I had him give devotions?

SHUSTER: Yes, why choose him?

ANDERSON: Yes I did. See, since I was president of the society my last year and so I was responsible for part of the program. And I asked...I remember asking Billy a couple times (at least two times) that he would come and bring a brief devotional. And I would remember him planting his two feet on the floor and taking off.

SHUSTER: [Laughs] why did you ask him as opposed to someone else?

ANDERSON: Why did I ask him?

SHUSTER: Uh-huh.

ANDERSON: Partly because of his...because of his clear, Christian testimony, right from the very beginning. He was known as a solid, earnest Christian. That would be the impression that people would have of him. Friendly and then he would also reveal his love of Christ.

SHUSTER: And you said that he would put his two feet down and start right off...

ANDERSON: Could you say that again? Excuse me.

SHUSTER: You said when he gave his devotions, he put his two feet down and would start right off.

ANDERSON: [Laughs] Oh, well just you know, the way he just took off. Because he was a very emphatic, you know? It was obvious what he believed. And he said it with real emphasis. And convinced...that’s just my impression. How I remember him from way back as he still would be true...as would still be true of him.

SHUSTER: Do you recall what he talked about?

ANDERSON: No I don’t. No, no. I don’t think I could come up with any...anything. It was the impression that he made when he gave his devotions. It would be you know about a ten minute thing, something like that. But he was very emphatic, very convincing, very earnest. He expressed back there the same kind of emphasis that you see...that you’ve seen in him all through his years.

SHUSTER: How did the other members of the club respond to him?

ANDERSON: Well they all liked him. And they...there’s no question that when he began to speak, people would listen. That was true in his day, that was true in the Tabernacle where he served as the pastor. But he...there’s no question that when he began to speak that he caught the attention of people and he did so because of his sincerity and his forthrightness. A very convincing manner every time he preached. Every time he talked.

SHUSTER: Besides the devotions, did he participate in the life of the club?

ANDERSON: Not many...not that I remember. I don’t remember that he...we got him to do anything else other than the devotions. Because that was his specialty in a sense. So I had him several times give the devotional period as we began our sessions each Friday night.

SHUSTER: What did he look like? What was his physical appearance?

ANDERSON: Well he was tall, and in my view, I’d say he was handsome.... He...everywhere he went (partly because of his...that he was tall and in a sense handsome) he always made an impression.

SHUSTER: What did he sound like? I mean did he have a southern accent? What...?

ANDERSON: He didn’t sound much different than he did when he became so well known as an evangelist. Very emphatic, very clear cut.... I dont...let’s see if I can think of some other adjectives that would somehow describe him. Very direct...in what he had to say. No question about what he meant. Very clear, cogent. Convincing.

SHUSTER: You mentioned you had an anthropology class together?

ANDERSON: I think...I think that we were in an anthropology class together. That’s the only time that we...and I’m not quite sure of that. And of course he wouldn’t remember. But...partly because he majored in anthropology. Or at least that became one of his interests. And Grigolia, you know, was one of his favorite lecturers in class and teachers. And I think...I took one...I took a couple anthropology classes from Grigolia partly because of him.

SHUSTER: Probably because of Graham?

ANDERSON: Grigolia, not because of Billy. But I’m quite sure that we were in one of those classes together.

SHUSTER: What kind of teacher was Alexander Grigolia?

ANDERSON: He was...he had an accent. It was not the easiest thing for him to teach in English. He...and so, it was...not limited in a sense...that was not his natural, not his native language. And so he struggled a little to speak English. But he was very, very convincing. He was very congenial, he would...he was very popular. There are a lot of people I think like me who took an anthropology class mainly because of him. And I think that may have been one.... Billy Graham majored in anthropology, didn’t he?

SHUSTER: Yes, he did.

ANDERSON: Yeah, he did. And I’m sure he majored in anthropology first because of his interest in Christian evidences but also it would be because of Grigolia himself. He was a very popular professor.

SHUSTER: What made him popular?

ANDERSON: Why was he?

SHUSTER: Yes.

ANDERSON: Uh...because...well first I think it was because of his personality. And that he was...he was humble. He was humorous. He knew his subject. He had a personal interest in students. It was just....all the attributes that would make a prof popular, he had it.

SHUSTER: Did you ever hear Billy Graham preach at the Tabernacle?

ANDERSON: Yes, several times because before he became the pastor, I was...I attended when I was there, I was in gospel team work every once in a while so I was gone a lot of the time. But whenever I had the opportunity, I would go there to the Tab to hear Dr. Edman. He was one of my favorite profs, and I majored in history partly because of him. But then also, I went after Billy Graham became the pastor. So I was there for...not very long because...I’m not sure he was the pastor by the time I left. But he was...he was...I think he was. He followed Dr. Edman. You may know better than I do about that.

SHUSTER: Well, he officially became pastor there in September ‘41, so it was probably after you left.

ANDERSON: He became...in ‘41 he became...?

SHUSTER: Officially, but he preached there several times before that.

ANDERSON: Yes. Well, that would be it. See, I graduated in ‘41, so I...I did go there when he was the pastor. Several times.

SHUSTER: What kind of preacher was Edman? How would you describe him at the Tabernacle?

ANDERSON: Oh...what kind of preacher was Edman?

SHUSTER: Uh-huh.

ANDERSON: He would be something of a contrast to Billy Graham. In that he would be...he was a teacher, not an evangelist. And...but he was...he was emphatic. He was humorous. He was warm and friendly. But he was also a real expositor. In contrast in a sense to Billy Graham in those early days. Billy Graham right from the word “go” was an evangelist. And he had an evangelistic flavor in what he had to say as well as how he said it. While Edman was a professor. And then...so there was a real contrast between the two of them.
 
SHUSTER: Who went to the Tabernacle? Who made up the congregation?

ANDERSON: Well, yes. There was a congregation. They had started as a smaller group. And then partly because of the teaching of Dr. Edman and others, students began to come. They didn’t start because they were planning to attract students. But it became a place where students went. And because of Dr. Edman and also because of Billy Graham.

SHUSTER: You say they didn’t start to attract students...

ANDERSON: Sorry say that again?

SHUSTER: You say they didn’t start to attract students. How did they start? Who were they trying to attract?

ANDERSON: I don’t know if they were...they were not a break off group from some other church. They started as people who went to the...what was called the Tab. And they...they...this is just now my impression that they started as a smaller group and they just kept on growing partly because of their Bible teaching. And being at Wheaton, there were Wheaton students that were attracted to their informal and their...Scriptural approach.

SHUSTER: Did people from the town also go to the Tabernacle?

ANDERSON: Yes, they did. The core...the core of the Tabernacle was not the students. They came...they came partly as a result of the fact that there was this core of older Christians who were there. And they were the ones that started the Tab and kept the Tab going.

SHUSTER: So what...where...what did the Tabernacle look like inside?

ANDERSON: Oh it was just an auditorium, you know? I’m not...was it...some small, social group...

SHUSTER: Well it was in the Masonic...

ANDERSON: ...they...it was a rented place in downtown.

SHUSTER: Yes it was downtown at the Masonic hall. The building is still standing.

ANDERSON: Yeah, yeah. I’d forgotten that. Right.

SHUSTER: About how many people were there every...on a Sunday?

ANDERSON: It was not big. I don’t think it was ever big because of the fact that it was limited in size. My guess is that there were two, three, maybe up to 400 once in a while at the most. My guess would be 2-300.

SHUSTER: [Coughing] Excuse me.

ANDERSON: And I think that would have been true when Billy was the pastor as well. I think it was limited by the size of the auditorium.

SHUSTER: What did the service usually consist of?

ANDERSON: What was the music like?

SHUSTER: No what was the service consist of besides the sermon?

ANDERSON: What did the sermon consist of?

SHUSTER: No what did the service, besides the sermon. What was in the service?

ANDERSON: Oh...well for Dr. Edman, it would be expository. For Billy Graham it would be both expository and it would be evangelistic.

UNIDENTIFIED WOMAN AT ANDERSON” END OF THE PHONE: Herb, I think he means what various parts of the whole service were there? Did they have music, did they have soloists?

ANDERSON: Oh I see. Well, yeah they did. For that day, it was fairly traditional. [Shuster coughing] They would have some hymns and prayer. And...an offering and a message. And that would be about it. It was not [Shuster coughing] that much different from any other evangelical place.

SHUSTER: What made it different? Oh you said it was no different? Or it was different?

ANDERSON: No, I would say it was not different.

SHUSTER: Not different, oh I see.

ANDERSON: Not different. Except for the fact that both when Dr. Edman was there and when Billy was there, it would be expository.

SHUSTER: Do you recall some of the topics of either Dr. Edman or Billy Graham’s sermons?

ANDERSON: No, no I wouldn’t. I wouldn’t be able to do that.

SHUSTER: Did they give an invitation in the service?

ANDERSON: Yes, once. Not all the time. At least not when...not when Dr. Edman was the pastor and I was attending. When Billy Graham was, I’m sure there was...there would have been an invitation.

SHUSTER: But you don’t recall specifically?

ANDERSON: I don’t...like most evangelical churches at the conclusion, there would be the invitation at the end of the service to come forward and receive Christ or make some kind of public testimony or to join a group of believers.

SHUSTER: Anything else you’d like to say about the Tabernacle?

ANDERSON: No, no. I...no...it was a popular place. It was popular with the students both when Dr. Edman was there and when Billy was there. I think there may have been even more students coming when Billy would be there. But no...it was pretty traditional but very informal. And friendly.

SHUSTER: Billy Graham wrote in his memoirs that Wheaton was the first place...

ANDERSON: Say that again?

SHUSTER: Billy wrote in his memoirs that Wheaton was the first place where he had African Americans as students.

ANDERSON: Oh. Yes. That was one of your...

SHUSTER: Do you recall any black students at Wheaton?

ANDERSON: Yes. There was one who became a close friend of mine. A very fine...black. And he became my friend, and we kept up a relationship after graduation. And I’m...I don’t remember any kind of...any kind of racism. Even though there were southern students, you know, they came from the south. But I don’t remember any time for the few blacks who would come there...they were well received and appreciated. And as far as I know, there was no racism at all at any time that I can remember.

SHUSTER: What was your friend’s name?

ANDERSON: What’s that?

SHUSTER: What was your friend’s name?

ANDERSON: Now I wish I could remember. I wish...if I saw a picture of him, I would remember. But I...what his name? I don’t know. No.

SHUSTER: The...you mentioned that you had been friends and saw each other on campus...

ANDERSON: That I was what?

SHUSTER: You mentioned that you were friends with Billy Graham. You saw each other on campus...

ANDERSON: Not, not...we were just...we were not close friends. We...we met each other every once in a while. And we were friends...while...while there are Wheaton. But we were not close friends.

SHUSTER: So what kind of things did you talk about when you met?

ANDERSON: Uh...well some of it could have been with classes. We...I know we...talked occasionally about...about Grigolia for example. He was a point of contact for Billy Graham and myself because we both admired Grigolia as he was called, or Grig. But...I don’t remember any...primarily because we were not that intimate. We were friends, but we were not intimate friends.

SHUSTER: Did you go to his rooms?

ANDERSON: What’s that?

SHUSTER: Did you ever go to his room? He lived on Irving Street.

ANDERSON: Say that again?

SHUSTER: Did you ever go to his room? He lived in a house on Irving Street.

ANDERSON: No, no, no. I didn’t no. It was only on the campus. And as I said, we were not that close. We were friends. As he was a friend with a lot of people, you know. But we were not close friends.

SHUSTER: Had he started dating Ruth Graham...Ruth Bell when you were a student?

ANDERSON: What?

SHUSTER: Had he started dating Ruth Bell while you were still a student?

ANDERSON: Oh yeah. In fact I remember that quite distinctly. Because I knew Ruth and I knew her sister. And her sister was sort of flaky [woman laughs in background]. In contrast to Ruth. You know? And I was...when Billy began to become interested in Ruth, I was...I was all in favor of it because I thought she would make a wonderful...wonderful partner for Billy. And Billy for her as well, you know? She was a...she was considered...she had a very good reputation on the campus. Ruth Graham.

SHUSTER: Why did she...

ANDERSON: And when I watched this relationship develop, I was very grateful.

SHUSTER: Why did she have...

ANDERSON: For both Billy and for Ruth. I thought it was a good combination.

SHUSTER: Why? What made them good for each other?

ANDERSON: Well partly because they were both...interested. They were both sincere, earnest Christians. She had been...you know. She was...she had been raised on the missions. On a mission field. And as a result she was very...she was a good student. She was popular as Billy was. And I thought that...that’s great when they began to go with each other.

SHUSTER: What kind of couple did they make? How would you describe them as a couple?

ANDERSON: What kind of what?

SHUSTER: Couple.

ANDERSON: Uh...[laughs] not different from a lot of other couples. They were very interested in each other. Obviously they began. And I’ve read stories about their romance and how they got...how they became attracted to each other. But they were both highly regarded as Christians and as average...not brilliant students but just average students from a scholastic standpoint. They were a good combination. Well that didn’t really answer your question, did it?

SHUSTER: Well...I mean if that’s all you have to say about it, that’s fine. But you saw them together often?

ANDERSON: Well, yes I saw them...I saw them together quite, quite, quite often. Yes. Yes. They began to go with each other. Like I did with...with one who became my wife eventually.

SHUSTER: I want to talk a little about Youth for Christ too, but before I do that, is there anything else you wanted to say about Billy Graham at Wheaton? Any other memories or stories you might have?

ANDERSON: No, no. It was...only that we were friends, but not intimate friends. But I had a high regard for him as well as for Ruth. And...every time we met, we might engage in a little conversation. But we...I liked him. And he was a friend to me.

SHUSTER: Now...soon after you had graduated and after Graham graduated, Youth for Christ got started and you were both involved in that movement...

ANDERSON: Yeah, it just so happened. And that was a number of years later, you know? Billy Graham was the Youth For Christ evangelist. The first...the first Youth for Christ evangelist. And I was the Youth for Christ director in Salem, Oregon. And that’s when...when we had a little more time...when we...when the friendship that we had was a little deeper than it had been on the campus. Partly because we were both involved in Youth for Christ.

SHUSTER: Now before...

ANDERSON: I think I remember...I remember writing to you or something, I don’t remember. But I...one of the biggest rallies I had when we packed out the biggest auditorium in the town (in the town of Salem) when Billy Graham came. And they were late. It so happened that I think there was a Youth for Christ congress in Portland. And he was at the Portland Youth for Christ on Saturday night and so I couldn’t get him on Saturday night, but I had him on Sunday afternoon. And I got the biggest auditorium I could get, and the placed was packed out. And they were coming late. They were going about forty minutes late. And “what am I going to do with fifteen hundred people gathered....” But it just so happened there was a musical group in an Assembly of God church. And I got a hold of them and they entertained the people before Billy Graham and the others showed up. I remember Theodore Epp of the Back to the Bible broadcast coming to hear Billy Graham. And he wanted to see...he contacted me to see if he could see Billy Graham after the service. And of course I made that kind of arrangement.

SHUSTER: And this was in Salem?

ANDERSON: This was in Salem, Oregon.

SHUSTER: And so when Graham did arrive, how did the rally go?

ANDERSON: What was that? Say that again?

SHUSTER: When Graham did arrive, what did he talk about?

ANDERSON: Oh man...Bob Cook was there. You know Bob Cook was the president of Youth for Christ. And Billy was tired. And then so Bob Cook gave the main message. But again, it was the ten minutes or so that Billy (ten or fifteen minutes) that Billy Graham spoke that made the impact. In fact, a fellow that I had been working with who was not a believer, he came forward and received Christ that night . He was a very...he was very skeptical but Billy got through to him. And he became a Christian that day. It was a....

SHUSTER: Now had you also spoken with Graham at YFC meetings around Chicago before you moved to Salem?

ANDERSON: Uh...there were some...there were a number of places where I was...I became what was called the director of the student foreign missions fellowship so my emphasis was foreign missions and getting students, getting young people to go. And I traveled, went to different colleges all across the country in...an effort to get students to become interested in missions, in foreign missions. And so...I ... several times, at least twice, Billy Graham gave the evangelistic message. And before he spoke, I’d get up and give a challenge for young people to go to...to volunteer for missionary work.

SHUSTER: What was the typical YFC rally like?

ANDERSON: A lot of singing. Sometimes...sometimes they...some kind of a skit. But basically, it would be...music and a message. Not...it would be evangelistic. Always, wherever a Youth for Christ rally was, it was evangelistic. And with...concluding with an invitation to come forward. And when Billy Graham was the Youth for Christ evangelist, he may have set the stage for a number of rallies...and I’m sure he had something to do with the type of meeting that Youth for Christ had across the country.

SHUSTER: How do you mean that?

ANDERSON: How do I mean that?

SHUSTER: Uh-huh.

ANDERSON: I simply mean that partly because he is an evangelist and emphasized coming to Christ...it...he...and as the...national Youth for Christ director, he went from place to place in that part of his career as an evangelist. And in a sense, I think he certainly emphasized the fact that Youth for Christ was evangelistic. And this was its purpose to win young people to Jesus Christ.

SHUSTER: Do you recall...

ANDERSON: Does that answer your question?

SHUSTER: Yes, yes. It does. Do you recall an incidents or stories about Billy Graham in Youth for Christ when you were together in meetings?

ANDERSON: Uh...no other than that one. That you know I mentioned. He was...I was in Youth for Christ rallies with him when I was working with missions. Two or three times and in different places. In the Midwest, one time I remember in Minneapolis, there are different places where I...where I rubbed shoulders with Billy Graham . He...and I’m not sure he’d remember...he’d remember...he’d maybe remember, but I doubt it.

SHUSTER: Uh...do you...let’s see I was going...also going to ask you do you recall Torrey Johnson as a YFC speaker?

ANDERSON: Do I what?

SHUSTER: Torrey Johnson. Do you recall him as a YFC speaker?

ANDERSON: As...?

SHUSTER: Do you recall Torrey Johnson?

ANDERSON: Ask me again, excuse me.

SHUSTER: Do you recall Torrey Johnson?

ANDERSON: Oh yes, he was the president of Youth for Christ. I think the first president.

SHUSTER: Yes.

ANDERSON: And...I think Billy probably has...gives him some kind of credit for encouraging Billy in his evangelism. I don’t know what influence Torrey had on Billy because...I knew Billy before I think he ever knew Torrey Johnson. It was after he got into Youth for Christ and became the Youth for Christ evangelist and went around the country in Youth for Christ rallies that he got to know Torrey Johnson.

SHUSTER: Well is there anything else you’d like to add ,Dr. Anderson, about...?

ANDERSON: Well there would be one thing that I couldn’t help but think of as I thought of my relationship to Billy. It was...there was a time...I was a pastor of a fairly large church in Portland...Hinson Memorial Baptist Church. And when I was there, there was...there was something of a conflict between fundamentalists and evangelicals. If I can use those two phrases. And there were those who were hyper-fundamentalists in my congregation. And they wanted me to be a part of the committee as Billy Graham came to Portland in one of his evangelistic enterprises. One of the first ones he had in Portland. And I went to the banquet where...Billy was. That was before the evangelistic rally. And it was not just a rally, it was one or two weeks of evangelistic campaign. And I wanted to be a part of it. But I decided I better not . Better not be on the committee. And I remember when the master of ceremonies...he just happened to mention in a banquet, about 1,000 people in a banquet, that I was pastor of this church (well known church) and he said “Dr. Herb Anderson is here.” And what I remember very distinctly as he had me stand. And Billy...he...he waved his hand to me. That...that had nothing to do with what you’re going to talk about. But anyway, that’s one thing that I’ve never forgotten because of my personal relationship with Billy and how he...he in a sense, accentuated that friendship that we had as he...as he greeted me from a long distance at that banquet. And let me know that he was very happy to have me there.
 
SHUSTER: And that was at the Portland Crusade and you said...
 
ANDERSON: What’s that?
 
SHUSTER: ...that you had decided not to participate because of the fundamentalist criticism?
 
ANDERSON: Well yeah...I...well I didn’t want to create a problem in the congregation. So we would cooperate with the campaign. But rather than be an official part of what they wanted me to do, I decided I better just withdraw. Not be involved because then...it would create a conflict within the congregation. Because there were some hyper fundamentalists at that time...and that was part of Billy Graham’s experience at that time...as he said, he would not...he didn’t want any kind of exclusions in the people that would cooperate in his campaigns, the evangelistic campaigns...and so I decided not to become involved officially. But we were going to cooperate with the campaign when it started.
 
SHUSTER: Is there anything else you’d like to mention or bring up?
 
ANDERSON: Excuse me, go ahead, what?
 
SHUSTER: Is there anything else you’d like to mention or bring up?
 
ANDERSON: No, just that I...I...I do consider it a privilege that I got to know Billy on a more personal level than most people. Partly because of Wheaton and then because of even more because of Youth for Christ and our being involved in Youth for Christ. And the relationships that I had with him...he...he was a dear friend. And I admire him. And have admired him because of his stance and because of his evang...because of his zeal for Christ and evangelism.
 
SHUSTER: Well thank you, Dr. Anderson.
 
ANDERSON: Okay.
 

END OF TAPE
 


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Wheaton College 2014